From list-managers-owner@greatcircle.com Fri Sep 9 12:32:07 2005 X-Original-To: list-managers@greatcircle.com Received: from smtp.internet-tools.com (smtp.internet-tools.com [64.241.105.15]) by mycroft.greatcircle.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7935832C53E for ; Fri, 9 Sep 2005 12:32:06 -0700 (PDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 14:20:21 -0500 To: list-managers@greatcircle.com From: mark david mcCreary Subject: MSN Sender Id and mailing lists Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-MailScanner: Certified virus free by Sophos Anti-Virus X-Archive-Number: 200509/1 X-Sequence-Number: 1856 My recollection is that in June, Microsoft anounced they would require Sender ID (not SPF) at msn.com and hotmail.com. The Sender ID extends SPF to include the From: header, which in the case of mailing lists does not work very well. I already publish SPF version 1 records in my DNS TXT records. So far, my preliminary analysis is that I can leave these alone, and add a Resent-From header to my mailings. The Resent-From would contain my domain name, and should be verified in place of the From header. Therefore, all would be well. First, would anybody like to comment on this logic. Second, I have attempted to ask Microsoft/Hotmail this question, and here is a reply from the frontline support desk. There are no plans to change how we "enforce" Sender ID. There were incorrect reports about this a while ago; however we do not reject a message or place a message in the junk folder solely on the basis of the Sender ID test, nor do we plan to. I'm not sure they are answering the question that I asked, or was trying to ask. Does anybody have any knowledge pertaining to MSN/Hotmail plans with regards to Sender ID, and how mailing lists can cope. Thanks mark From list-managers-owner@greatcircle.com Fri Sep 9 16:44:31 2005 X-Original-To: list-managers@greatcircle.com Received: from xuxa.iecc.com (xuxa.iecc.com [208.31.42.42]) by mycroft.greatcircle.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 5820632C348 for ; Fri, 9 Sep 2005 16:44:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 9463 invoked by uid 100); 9 Sep 2005 23:44:23 -0000 Date: 9 Sep 2005 23:44:23 -0000 Message-ID: <20050909234423.9462.qmail@xuxa.iecc.com> From: John Levine To: list-managers@greatcircle.com Subject: Re: MSN Sender Id and mailing lists In-Reply-To: Organization: I.E.C.C., Trumansburg NY USA Cc: mdm@mail-list.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Archive-Number: 200509/2 X-Sequence-Number: 1857 > Does anybody have any knowledge pertaining to MSN/Hotmail plans with > regards to Sender ID, and how mailing lists can cope. I would suggest doing nothing at all. I doubt that Yahoo or other large list hosters plan to jump through Microsoft's hoops, while spammers and bulk advertisers are implementing Sender-ID like crazy. Earthlink and other ISPs that used to publish SPF records that Sender-ID could use have deleted them. So what's going to happen is that people will quickly realize that the yellow "no sender ID" box means that this is a message you probably want to read. The only reason I can see that Hotmail is doing this silly thing is that Chairman Bill said that spam would be solved in two years, and the two years are up in Jan 2006. R's, John