From list-managers-owner Sat Dec 3 07:50:08 1994 Received: (daemon@localhost) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) id HAA11711 for list-managers-outgoing; Sat, 3 Dec 1994 07:19:16 -0800 Received: from isolde.fct.unl.pt (isolde.fct.unl.pt [192.68.178.191]) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) with SMTP id HAA11706 for ; Sat, 3 Dec 1994 07:19:07 -0800 Received: from laminaria.fct.unl.pt by isolde.fct.unl.pt with SMTP id AA00688 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for ); Sat, 3 Dec 1994 16:17:58 +0100 Received: from educom2.fct.unl.pt by laminaria.fct.unl.pt (AIX 3.2/UCB 5.64/4.03) id AA17792; Sat, 3 Dec 1994 15:17:50 +0100 Message-Id: <9412031417.AA17792@laminaria.fct.unl.pt> X-Sender: px@pop.fct.unl.pt Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 3 Dec 1994 16:21:14 +0000 To: list-managers@greatcircle.com From: px@fct.unl.pt (Joaquim Baptista [pxQuim]) Subject: news -> mailing-list through moderated newsgroup status? Sender: list-managers-owner@GreatCircle.COM Precedence: bulk Greetings, On the subject of bidirectional gateways between news and mailing lists, I would like to propose the use of moderated newsgroups. General background: If a newsgroup is marked as moderated in a news server, posts to that newsgroup will be mailed to the moderator instead. The message mailed has all the headers of the original posting preserved in the body of the message, and is sent from "Usenet news". The moderator address is specified in a special "moderators" file in the NNTP server. Some organizations offer this file to newsreaders through NFS, and the reader does the mailing; others have the NNTP server accept the message and do the mailing. My current setup: Currently I have a special hierarchy lists.* with a newsgroup per gated mailing list. Users can't reply to the list. My proposed setup: Make all the newsgroups in lists.* moderated, with the moderator setup as "list-reply@nntpserver.domain". The program that receives the news adds an "Approved: news@nntpserver.domain" header, so that messages received from the list go straight to the server. In /usr/lib/aliases, add: list-reply: "| reply-gateway" This "reply-gateway" has a different configuration file with the real addresses of the mailing lists, such as: list-managers: list-managers@greatcircle.com The reply-gateway strips the "Usenet news" headers, rewrites the headers found in the body if appropiate, and mails the message to the real address. Advantages of this scheme: The newsgroup only gets "official" messages sent from the mailing list. There is no worry with duplicate messages, or messages rejected in moderated lists which were posted anyway in the local newsgroup. I really thing that this is desirable for moderated lists. Disadvantages: The only one that I see is in organizatons where the "moderators" file is replicated throughout the machines, and which use templates to send EVERY moderated post to uunet or similar. I would think that those organizations got what they were asking for. Comments requested: Can anyone smell a bug in this scheme? It seems too "simple" to me; am I overlooking something? (This message was sent to list-managers@greatcircle.com, and posted to news.admin.technical and news.software.nntp; replies should probably be sent to both list-managers and news.software.nntp) -- Joaquim Baptista, aka pxQuim Dept. Informatica, Univ. Nova de Lisboa, Portugal px@fct.unl.pt ... +351-1-295 3220 ... fax +351-1-295 5641 From list-managers-owner Sat Dec 3 08:34:06 1994 Received: (daemon@localhost) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) id IAA11842 for list-managers-outgoing; Sat, 3 Dec 1994 08:05:39 -0800 Received: from belnet.bellevue.k12.wa.us (belnet.bellevue.k12.wa.us [192.147.163.201]) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) with SMTP id IAA11837 for ; Sat, 3 Dec 1994 08:05:34 -0800 Received: by belnet.bellevue.k12.wa.us (1.37.109.4/16.2) id AA17289; Sat, 3 Dec 94 08:06:37 -0800 Date: Sat, 3 Dec 1994 08:06:36 -0700 (PDT) From: Sandi Ackerman Subject: Why no replies posted? To: list-managers@greatcircle.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: list-managers-owner@GreatCircle.COM Precedence: bulk Being new to this group, I read all of these great questions which are of interest to me. But I never receive any responses on the list. Why? Sandi From list-managers-owner Wed Dec 7 09:05:37 1994 Received: (daemon@localhost) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) id IAA08331 for list-managers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Dec 1994 08:37:43 -0800 Received: from bernco.gov (PLUTO.BERNCO.GOV [160.230.1.130]) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) with SMTP id IAA08324 for ; Wed, 7 Dec 1994 08:37:15 -0800 Received: from bart by bernco.gov (5.65/Ultrix3.0-C) id AA07901; Wed, 7 Dec 1994 09:35:58 -0700 Received: by bart.bernco.gov (5.51/6.2); Wed, 7 Dec 94 09:38:08 MST Date: Wed, 7 Dec 94 09:38:08 MST From: Chris Wayne Message-Id: <9412071638.AA12022@bart.bernco.gov> To: list-managers@greatcircle.com Subject: ftp mail Sender: list-managers-owner@GreatCircle.COM Precedence: bulk Hello, We're trying to setup a maillist using majordomo 1.92. However, I'm not the one doing the work (mail doesn't properly work on this machine, so I'm only the middle man between this list and the guy and his machine that our list is being setup on...clear?? :-) We are wanting a mail archive but my friend says we need ftpmail. I thought the majordomo source was complete?? therefore, where can a copy of ftpmail be found??? Please note that my address usually gets mutilated. My address is jdchris@bart.bernco.gov. thanks, chris From list-managers-owner Sun Dec 11 16:40:35 1994 Received: (daemon@localhost) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) id QAA00987 for list-managers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Dec 1994 16:21:46 -0800 Received: from miles.greatcircle.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) with ESMTP id QAA00976; Sun, 11 Dec 1994 16:21:43 -0800 Message-Id: <199412120021.QAA00976@miles.greatcircle.com> Date: Sun, 11 Dec 1994 16:21:42 -0800 From: Brent Chapman Subject: Administrivia: IP address changes at GreatCircle.COM Sender: list-managers-owner@GreatCircle.COM Precedence: bulk Apparently-To: list-managers-outgoing ------- Blind-Carbon-Copy To: Brent@greatcircle.com Subject: Administrivia: IP address changes at GreatCircle.COM Date: Sun, 11 Dec 1994 16:21:42 -0800 From: Brent Chapman FYI, we're changing our IP addresses (a necessary part of switching to our new 56 kb/s frame relay service), so there may be some transient problems over the next few days reaching various GreatCircle.COM machines (i.e., FTP.GreatCircle.COM, WWW.GreatCircle.COM, WAIS.GreatCircle.COM, etc.). Hopefully everything will stabilize no later than the end of the week. If you have trouble reaching one of our machines, just try again later; if the trouble persists for more than a day or two, please let us know by sending email to "root@GreatCircle.COM" or by calling us at 800-270-2562 (please ask to leave a message for Brent or Michael; the number is +1 415 962 0841 from outside the USA). Our apologies for any inconvenience, but I think we're all going to be much happier with our new, faster connection. - -Brent - -- Brent Chapman | Great Circle Associates | Call or email for info about Brent@GreatCircle.COM | 1057 West Dana Street | upcoming Internet Security +1 415 962 0841 | Mountain View, CA 94041 | Firewalls Tutorial dates ------- End of Blind-Carbon-Copy From list-managers-owner Mon Dec 12 06:09:50 1994 Received: (daemon@localhost) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) id GAA11123 for list-managers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Dec 1994 06:05:27 -0800 Received: from aspensys (aspensys.com [198.77.70.104]) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) with SMTP id GAA11118 for ; Mon, 12 Dec 1994 06:05:24 -0800 Received: from smtpinet.aspensys.com by aspensys (5.0/SMI-SVR4) id AA19768; Mon, 12 Dec 1994 09:02:21 +0500 Received: from cc:Mail by smtpinet.aspensys.com id AA787252016 Mon, 12 Dec 94 09:06:56 EST Date: Mon, 12 Dec 94 09:06:56 EST From: jmeritt@smtpinet.aspensys.com (Meritt, Jim) Message-Id: <9411127872.AA787252016@smtpinet.aspensys.com> To: list-managers@GreatCircle.COM Subject: multiple managers content-length: 125 Sender: list-managers-owner@GreatCircle.COM Precedence: bulk I have a listproc running. How do I designate multiple list managers for one of the lists? Jim Meritt From list-managers-owner Mon Dec 12 07:39:45 1994 Received: (daemon@localhost) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) id HAA11406 for list-managers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Dec 1994 07:13:07 -0800 Received: from aspensys (aspensys.aspensys.com [198.77.70.104]) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) with SMTP id HAA11401 for ; Mon, 12 Dec 1994 07:13:04 -0800 Received: from smtpinet.aspensys.com by aspensys (5.0/SMI-SVR4) id AA22609; Mon, 12 Dec 1994 10:10:07 +0500 Received: from cc:Mail by smtpinet.aspensys.com id AA787256081 Mon, 12 Dec 94 10:14:41 EST Date: Mon, 12 Dec 94 10:14:41 EST From: jmeritt@smtpinet.aspensys.com (Meritt, Jim) Message-Id: <9411127872.AA787256081@smtpinet.aspensys.com> To: list-managers@GreatCircle.COM Subject: sporatic operations content-length: 207 Sender: list-managers-owner@GreatCircle.COM Precedence: bulk I have a listproc at aspensys.com that works fine then, for no reason apparent to me, stops. This is more than slightly irritating, no to mention !@#$%. Suggestions? Jim Meritt From list-managers-owner Mon Dec 12 10:40:02 1994 Received: (daemon@localhost) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) id KAA12380 for list-managers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Dec 1994 10:27:57 -0800 Received: from [198.102.244.36] (quadra.greatcircle.com [198.102.244.36]) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) with SMTP id KAA12375; Mon, 12 Dec 1994 10:27:53 -0800 X-Sender: brent@miles.greatcircle.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 12 Dec 1994 10:26:52 -0800 To: jmeritt@smtpinet.aspensys.com (Meritt, Jim), list-managers@GreatCircle.COM From: Brent@GreatCircle.COM (Brent Chapman) Subject: Re: multiple managers Sender: list-managers-owner@GreatCircle.COM Precedence: bulk At 06:06 12/12/94, Meritt, Jim wrote: > I have a listproc running. How do I designate multiple list managers > for one of the lists? > > Jim Meritt Questions specific to a single mailing list manager (listproc, majordomo, whatever) should be addressed to that system's support list, not to the List-Managers list. Unfortunately, I don't recall the address of the listproc support list, but I'm sure someone else here can provide it for us. -Brent -- Brent Chapman | Great Circle Associates | Call or email for info about Brent@GreatCircle.COM | 1057 West Dana Street | upcoming Internet Security +1 415 962 0841 | Mountain View, CA 94041 | Firewalls Tutorial dates From list-managers-owner Mon Dec 12 11:09:47 1994 Received: (daemon@localhost) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) id KAA12599 for list-managers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Dec 1994 10:48:23 -0800 Received: from uu9.psi.com (uu9.psi.com [38.145.107.9]) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) with SMTP id KAA12594 for ; Mon, 12 Dec 1994 10:48:15 -0800 Received: from uu0981.UUCP by uu9.psi.com (5.65b/4.0.071791-PSI/PSINet) via UUCP; id AA11049 for ; Mon, 12 Dec 94 13:39:13 -0500 To: List-managers@greatcircle.com Subject: Need listserv From: ted.kraus@syncomm.com (TED KRAUS) Message-Id: <89F8325.03E800C7FD.uuout@syncomm.com> Date: Mon, 12 Dec 94 13:25:00 -0400 Organization: Synergy Online, Parsippany, NJ (201) 331-1797 Reply-To: ted.kraus@syncomm.com (TED KRAUS) References: <89F8222.03E800C7D1.uuout@syncomm.com> X-Mailreader: PCBoard Version 15.21 X-Mailer: PCBoard/UUOUT Version 1.10 Sender: list-managers-owner@GreatCircle.COM Precedence: bulk Hi I'm using pcbuucp to manage 4 lists. While it's OK, it is not great Does anyone know of other software I can use on a PC and where can I get it thanks ted.kraus@property.com From list-managers-owner Tue Dec 13 00:09:46 1994 Received: (daemon@localhost) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) id XAA19604 for list-managers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Dec 1994 23:56:03 -0800 Received: from ix.ix.netcom.com (ix.ix.netcom.com [199.182.120.2]) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) with ESMTP id XAA19599; Mon, 12 Dec 1994 23:55:59 -0800 Received: from by ix.ix.netcom.com (8.6.9/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id XAA07225; Mon, 12 Dec 1994 23:42:01 -0800 Date: Mon, 12 Dec 1994 23:42:01 -0800 Message-Id: <199412130742.XAA07225@ix.ix.netcom.com> From: actuary@ix.netcom.com (LIONEL GOLDBERG) Subject: Court Ordered Liquidation - Computer Memory - CPU's & Hdsk Drives To: LAWSCH-L@AUVM.bitnet Sender: list-managers-owner@GreatCircle.COM Precedence: bulk Choice Trading Company, Court Appointed Liquidators, have been assigned to liquidate the following Multi-Million Dollar inventory of computer Memory Chips, CPU's and Hard Disk Drives. All items are new and come with applicable manufactures warranty. Prices quoted include all state and local taxes plus shipping and handling. Order Cost Number Mfg. Description (EACH) Memory 1524 Toshiba 30 Pin Simms 1x3 70ns 1 meg $ 25.00 1525 Toshiba 30 Pin Simms 1x9 70ns 1 meg 25.00 1526 Toshiba 30 Pin Simms 4x9 70ns 4 meg 100.00 1527 Toshiba 30 Pin Simms 1x3 60ns 1 meg 26.00 1528 Toshiba 30 Pin Simms 1x9 60ns 1 meg 26.00 1529 Toshiba 30 Pin Simms 4x9 60ns 4 meg 106.00 1624 Toshiba 72 Pin Simms 512x36 70ns 2 meg 50.00 1625 Toshiba 72 Pin Simms 1x36 70ns 4 meg 100.00 1626 Toshiba 72 Pin Simms 2x36 70ns 8 meg 200.00 1627 Toshiba 72 Pin Simms 4x36 70ns 16 meg 400.00 1628 Toshiba 72 Pin Simms 8x36 70ns 32 meg 800.00 1624 Toshiba 72 Pin Simms 512x36 60ns 2 meg 52.00 1625 Toshiba 72 Pin Simms 1x36 60ns 4 meg 104.00 1626 Toshiba 72 Pin Simms 2x36 60ns 8 meg 208.00 1627 Toshiba 72 Pin Simms 4x36 60ns 16 meg 416.00 1628 Toshiba 72 Pin Simms 8x36 60ns 32 meg 832.00 Memory for the Macintosh 1122 Toshiba 1 meg x 8 Simm Module 70ns 1 meg 31.00 1123 Toshiba 2 meg x 8 Simm Module 70ns 2 meg 62.00 1124 Toshiba 4 meg x 8 Simm Module 70ns 4 meg 109.00 CPU's 1276 Intel 80486 DX/33 115.00 1277 Intel 80486 DX/50 188.00 1278 Intel 80486 DX-2/66 156.00 1279 Intel 80486 DX-4/75 358.00 1280 Intel 80486 DX-4/100 498.00 1281 Intel Pentium 80501-60 366.00 1282 Intel Pentium 80501-66 453.00 1283 Intel Pentium 80502-90 558.00 Hard Disk Drives Seagate Barracuda Drives 1351 Seagate ST11950N 8ms 3.5" 1.69 GB SCSI 658.00 1352 Seagate ST12550N 8ms 3.5" 2.1 GB SCSI 899.00 1353 Seagate ST15150N 8ms 3.5" 4.2 GB SCSI 1,526.00 1354 Seagate ST31200N 11ms 3.5" 1.05 GB SCSI 538.00 1355 Seagate ST11900N 9ms 3.5" 1.7 GB SCSI 628.00 1366 Seagate ST2400A 9ms 3.5" 2.1 GB SCSI 856.00 1367 Seagate ST15230N 9ms 3.5" 4.29 GB SCSI 1,454.00 1368 Seagate ST41080N 11ms 5.5" 9.08 GB SCSI 2,848.00 Western Digital 1366 Western AC2340 12ms 3.5" 340 MB IDE 122.00 1367 Western AC2420 12ms 3.5" 420 MB IDE 136.00 1368 Western AC2540 12ms 3.5" 540 MB IDE 160.00 1369 Western AC2700 12ms 3.5" 731 MB IDE 230.00 Conner 1372 Connor CFS420A 14ms 3.5" 420 MB IDE 138.00 1373 Connor CFA540A 10ms 3.5" 540 MB IDE 168.00 1374 Connor CFA1080A 10ms 3.5" 1080 MB IDE 408.00 ORDERING INFORMATION To order please use a company order form/letterhead or if for personal use, use a plain white sheet of paper with your return address. List the items desired by order number, the quantity and total cost. Send your order with check or money order payable to Choice Trading Company to: Choice Trading Company Order Processing Lot #1776 86228 Terminal Annex Los Angeles, Ca. 90086-0228 Orders are processed on a first come basis. Adjustments and refunds will be made immediately for items that have sold out. Please allow 2 to 3 Weeks for shipping. Due to court ordered restrictions we are unable to accept COD, phone or credit card orders. This public offering is valid through December 30, 1994. Any unsold inventories will be auctioned. For auction information please send a self addressed stamped enveloped to: Choice Trading Company Lot #1776 202 So. Broadway Los Angeles, Ca. 90012 (213) 856 6172 If you are unable to use this information, please pass it on to someone who may. Lionel M. Goldberg Actuary From list-managers-owner Tue Dec 13 08:40:22 1994 Received: (daemon@localhost) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) id IAA25512 for list-managers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 08:13:53 -0800 Received: from maroon.tc.umn.edu (maroon.tc.umn.edu [128.101.118.21]) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) with SMTP id IAA25507 for ; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 08:13:48 -0800 Received: from dialup-1-53.gw.umn.edu by maroon.tc.umn.edu; Tue, 13 Dec 94 10:08:01 -0500 Date: Tue, 13 Dec 94 10:07:39 CST From: "Fred H Olson WB0YQM" Message-Id: <49857.fholson@maroon.tc.umn.edu> X-Minuet-Version: Minuet1.0_Beta_17A Reply-To: X-POPMail-Charset: English To: List-Managers@GreatCircle.COM Subject: Fwd: Your ad posting to our mailing list Sender: list-managers-owner@GreatCircle.COM Precedence: bulk ----- Forwarded message begins here ----- From: Fred H Olson WB0YQM To: ACTUARY@IX.NETCOM.COM Date: Tue, 13 Dec 94 10:06:59 CST Subject: Your ad posting to our mailing list TO: Choice Trading Company Lot #1776 202 So. Broadway Los Angeles, Ca. 90012 (213) 856 6172 Lionel M. Goldberg Actuary >Reason for rejection: sender not subscribed. >------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >Choice Trading Company, Court Appointed Liquidators, have >been assigned to liquidate the following Multi-Million Dollar >inventory of computer Memory Chips, CPU's and Hard Disk Drives. >All items are new and come with applicable manufactures warranty. >Prices quoted include all state and local taxes plus shipping and >handling. I am writing to protest your recent inappropriate, unwelcome and unauthorized attempt to post your long advertisement to our mailing list. I request that you refrain from doing this and post an apology to List-Managers@GreatCircle.COM If you do not do so your reputation on the net will be tarnished worse than it already has been. Sincerely, Fred ------ Forwarded message ends here ------ -- Fred H. Olson fholson@uci.com (612)588-9532 Amateur radio: WB0YQM 1221 Russell Av N, Minneapolis, MN 55411 Sysop of COHOUSING-L listserv & gopherspace: gopher.uci.com or via EDIN gopher in Calif. Now avail. Cohousing-WWW (see gopher for URL) || TC Freenet goes public 1/95 |4AI From list-managers-owner Tue Dec 13 10:39:56 1994 Received: (daemon@localhost) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) id KAA27060 for list-managers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 10:19:33 -0800 Received: from suntan.Tandem.com (suntan.tandem.com [192.216.221.8]) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) with SMTP id KAA27055 for ; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 10:19:28 -0800 Received: from adm.loc3.tandem.com by suntan.Tandem.com (4.1/suntan5.940222) for List-Managers@greatcircle.com id AA02610; Tue, 13 Dec 94 10:17:42 PST Received: from zorch.loc3.tandem.com by adm.loc3.tandem.com (4.1/6main.940209) id AA26077; Tue, 13 Dec 94 10:14:16 PST Received: by zorch.loc3.tandem.com (4.1/6leaf.940209) id AA01581; Tue, 13 Dec 94 10:17:41 PST Date: Tue, 13 Dec 94 10:17:41 PST From: scott@loc3.tandem.com (mueller_scott) Message-Id: <9412131817.AA01581@zorch.loc3.tandem.com> To: List-Managers@greatcircle.com Subject: anyone got an anti-spam filter? Sender: list-managers-owner@GreatCircle.COM Precedence: bulk Anyone got a good filter that rejects postings from non-subscribed addresses? Something that drops in front of sendmail would be ideal. Ideally it sends them a notice that sending advertisements will cost them money. :-) \scott From list-managers-owner Tue Dec 13 10:41:53 1994 Received: (daemon@localhost) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) id KAA27162 for list-managers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 10:30:51 -0800 Received: from papaya.ummed.edu (root@papaya.UMMED.EDU [146.189.64.2]) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) with ESMTP id KAA27157 for ; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 10:30:48 -0800 Received: (from naleks@localhost) by papaya.ummed.edu with id NAA25937; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 13:29:32 -0500 Date: Tue, 13 Dec 1994 13:29:32 -0500 (EST) From: Norm Aleks X-Sender: naleks@papaya.ummed.edu To: list-managers@greatcircle.com Subject: "Spam Protection" -- can we automate it? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: list-managers-owner@GreatCircle.COM Precedence: bulk [ I have also posted this message to comp.mail.list-admin.software. It's hard for me to manage this in a clean way so you'll see it twice. Sorry.] Well, another annoying spam has just gone out (the "computer inventory liquidation" one, from ix.netcom.com), posted to dozens of lists. This will only happen more frequently -- what can we do about it? Anyone whose lists are publicly known is going to get hit sooner or later. One possibility is to restrict who can post messages, either to subscribers of the list or to a list moderator. List moderation almost certainly solves the problem, but also changes the dynamics of a list in a way that some don't want. Restricting to members of the list is also sometimes not what people want. But these are solutions we can use right now. I have started thinking about fancier ways of blocking spams ... could it be automated? My thought is to go through a process something like this: before distributing a message, calculate an MD5 checksum on the message body. Then send a packet to some central "spam protection" server, telling it your list name, the checksum, and the sender address; the spam-protection server will reply back with some information like this: Msgs w/this checksum Msgs from this sender in the past hour # of lists # of lists in the past 24 hrs # of lists # of lists A sample suspicious response might be "the same message has been posted to 99 lists in the past hour, and to 400 lists in the past 24 hours; this sender has posted messages to 179 lists in the past hour, and to 892 lists in the past 24 hours." If your MLM got back a reply like that, it might very well decide not to distribute the message. It seems something like this could help avoid the BIG spams ... of course it wouldn't help the first few lists that got hit. In terms of performance ... there probably would need to be several regional servers, which could then talk to each other, but that's more of a network load issue than a server load issue. In eyeballing the numbers of requests we could expect, it seems to me the load on the spam-protection server would be less than that on a moderately busy DNS. What do you think? It would be particularly interesting to hear from MLM authors whether this sounds implementable ... Norm From list-managers-owner Tue Dec 13 13:39:41 1994 Received: (daemon@localhost) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) id NAA29142 for list-managers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 13:29:15 -0800 Received: from Sun.COM (Sun.COM [192.9.9.1]) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) with SMTP id NAA29137 for ; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 13:29:11 -0800 Received: from EBay.Sun.COM (female.EBay.Sun.COM) by Sun.COM (sun-barr.Sun.COM) id AA17323; Tue, 13 Dec 94 13:27:48 PST Received: from aiki.Ebay.Sun.COM by EBay.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6.9/SMI-5.3) id NAA22319; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 13:24:46 -0800 Received: by aiki.Ebay.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6.9/SMI-SVR4) id NAA00816; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 13:21:41 -0800 Date: Tue, 13 Dec 1994 13:21:41 -0800 From: Kenneth.Kron@EBay.Sun.COM (Kenneth Kron - Network Security) Message-Id: <199412132121.NAA00816@aiki.Ebay.Sun.COM> To: list-managers@greatcircle.com Subject: "Spam Protection" - Infrastructure vs policy X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Sender: list-managers-owner@GreatCircle.COM Precedence: bulk While the "Global Spam Protection" proposal is intellectually interesting I just don't see people donating and maintaining enough "SPAM" servers for it to work. Here's my alternate proposal. I think the solution that will work for most lists is to setup your list(s) as a "members only" list. So only members are allowed to post. It will stop both non-commercial SPAM, subscribe requests that get posted to the list and also handle commercial SPAM. If you wanted to get really paranoid you could put all *new* members on a separate moderated list and have them automagically migrated after a week or something. This would stop someone from subing posting SPAM unsub subbing I realize this could still be worked around but that would require more foresight and planning than most SPAM generators seem capable of :^). You *might* want to add a "additional accepted addresses list" for members who have multiple accounts but other than that it should work. On a personal note what I do with every piece of "SPAM" I recieve is I respond to it *incuding* the full text of the original messsage and cc the postmaster at the site. ----------------- To whom it may concern: I recently recieved a your unsolicited email message. Please refrain from sending me any messages in the future. Kenneth <- Original message goes here -> ----------------- This accomplishes several things. 1) If there is a postmaster he is aware of the problem and if enough people do this he will make sure it stops. 2) The postmaster gets motiviated to educate his users not to do this in the future. I do not consider this injuring an innocent party. Sites have to take *some level* of responsibility for things that occur there. 3) It wastes some of the posters time opening reading and disposing of the message I sent him back. 4) It increases the posters (or his sites) costs for sending the message in time, bandwidth, disk space, etc. The primary reason people post SPAM to the whole worldis because it's free or nearly free. If you drive the cost up the incidents will go down. Yes it costs the me also but if enough people respond in kind it wreaks havoc on the sender. ====================== Kenneth Kron -- Network Security Group kron@aiki.ebay.sun.com Phone: 408-276-0475 Perhaps the world is a banquet. Everyone is an invited guest but eventually you're on the menu > > [ I have also posted this message to comp.mail.list-admin.software. It's > hard for me to manage this in a clean way so you'll see it twice. Sorry.] > > Well, another annoying spam has just gone out (the "computer inventory > liquidation" one, from ix.netcom.com), posted to dozens of lists. This > will only happen more frequently -- what can we do about it? Anyone whose > lists are publicly known is going to get hit sooner or later. > > One possibility is to restrict who can post messages, either to subscribers > of the list or to a list moderator. List moderation almost certainly > solves the problem, but also changes the dynamics of a list in a way that > some don't want. Restricting to members of the list is also sometimes not > what people want. But these are solutions we can use right now. > > I have started thinking about fancier ways of blocking spams ... could it > be automated? My thought is to go through a process something like this: > before distributing a message, calculate an MD5 checksum on the message > body. Then send a packet to some central "spam protection" server, telling > it your list name, the checksum, and the sender address; the > spam-protection server will reply back with some information like this: > > Msgs w/this checksum Msgs from this sender > in the past hour # of lists # of lists > in the past 24 hrs # of lists # of lists > > A sample suspicious response might be "the same message has been posted to > 99 lists in the past hour, and to 400 lists in the past 24 hours; this > sender has posted messages to 179 lists in the past hour, and to 892 lists > in the past 24 hours." If your MLM got back a reply like that, it might > very well decide not to distribute the message. > > It seems something like this could help avoid the BIG spams ... of course > it wouldn't help the first few lists that got hit. > > In terms of performance ... there probably would need to be several > regional servers, which could then talk to each other, but that's more of a > network load issue than a server load issue. In eyeballing the numbers of > requests we could expect, it seems to me the load on the spam-protection > server would be less than that on a moderately busy DNS. > > What do you think? It would be particularly interesting to hear from MLM > authors whether this sounds implementable ... > > Norm > From list-managers-owner Tue Dec 13 14:39:41 1994 Received: (daemon@localhost) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) id OAA29513 for list-managers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 14:31:12 -0800 Received: from svcdudes.com (bastion.svcdudes.com [198.6.226.3]) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) with SMTP id OAA29508 for ; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 14:31:09 -0800 Message-Id: <9412132234.AA08578@svcdudes.com> Received: by moose.svcdudes.com (NX5.67d/NX3.0X) id AA02454; Tue, 13 Dec 94 14:33:36 -0800 Received: by NeXT.Mailer (1.112.1) Content-Type: text/plain Mime-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3 v112.1) From: Michael Rutman Date: Tue, 13 Dec 94 14:33:34 -0800 To: list-managers@greatcircle.com Subject: Charge for Spamming and it will go away Sender: list-managers-owner@GreatCircle.COM Precedence: bulk First, let's admit it, as long as Spamming works, no amount of education is going to stop it. By working, I mean a very cheap way to make money. You can tell people to not give them money, but enough people will that spamming will remain effective. Even the Green Card lawyers got clients. So, the solution is to make it more expensive. Each mailing list that wants to avoid spamming puts in their charter that solicitations of multiple people will cost some specified amount of money sent to the list manager. When someone posts the first time, Majordomo will automatically send the poster a note telling him about this policy, forwards the message to the list-owner, and saves the posters address so this only happens the first time. If the poster posts again, the list-owner can legally send him a bill, and charge him for wire fraud if he fails to pay the bill. Wire-fraud, being a felony, is a rather unpleasent thing to be charged with. Especially as it can be shown that the poster did it right after being warned about the charges. BTW-I put in there that it's only solicitations of multiple people so people can still say things like, "anyone want to buy/sell my rumple computer with fratz monitor," but not "Here is my price list, notice how cheap it is because I don't pay for my own advertisments." This will require new versions of Majordomo and other list servers, but the modifications are small, list managers might actually get some compensation for their good work, and spamming will decrease as costs go up. --- Michael Rutman | moose@svcdudes.com Programmer | Macintosh and NeXT programmer Software Ventures | maker of MicroPhone Pro #include | really offensive political statement From list-managers-owner Tue Dec 13 15:09:58 1994 Received: (daemon@localhost) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) id PAA29725 for list-managers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 15:03:09 -0800 Received: from duke.cs.duke.edu (duke.cs.duke.edu [152.3.140.1]) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) with SMTP id PAA29719 for ; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 15:02:51 -0800 Received: from london.chem.duke.edu by duke.cs.duke.edu (5.65/3.10G/4.1.3) id AA15337; Tue, 13 Dec 94 18:01:28 -0500 Received: from affymax.chem.duke.edu by london.chem.duke.edu (5.64/1.19LP/4.1.1) id AA10928; Tue, 13 Dec 94 18:01:25 -0500 Received: by affymax.chem.duke.edu (5.64/2.12L/4.1) id AA24788; Tue, 13 Dec 94 18:01:25 -0500 Date: Tue, 13 Dec 94 18:01:25 -0500 From: yuji@chem.duke.edu (Yuji Shinozaki) Message-Id: <9412132301.AA24788@affymax.chem.duke.edu> To: list-managers@greatcircle.com, moose@svcdudes.com Subject: Re: Charge for Spamming and it will go away Sender: list-managers-owner@GreatCircle.COM Precedence: bulk Michael Rutman (moose@svcdudes.com) wrote: > If the poster posts again, the list-owner can legally send him a bill, and > charge him for wire fraud if he fails to pay the bill. Wire-fraud, being a > felony, is a rather unpleasent thing to be charged with. Especially as it > can be shown that the poster did it right after being warned about the > charges. > It would be interesting to hear the legal precedence to this. I vaguely remember a news piece about a man who successfully charged phone solicitors for time spent "in consultation" on the phone. Something on the order of $500/call. I believe they were only civil charges, but they had solid legal grounds. yuji ---- Yuji Shinozaki Computer Systems Manager (919)660-1514 Box 90347 / Dept of Chemistry yuji@chem.duke.edu Duke University http://www.chem.duke.edu Durham, NC 27708-0347 From list-managers-owner Tue Dec 13 15:39:43 1994 Received: (daemon@localhost) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) id PAA29924 for list-managers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 15:23:05 -0800 Received: from hawkwind.utcs.utoronto.ca (hawkwind.utcs.utoronto.ca [128.100.102.51]) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) with SMTP id PAA29919 for ; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 15:23:01 -0800 Received: from localhost by hawkwind.utcs.utoronto.ca with SMTP id <24145>; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 18:21:33 -0500 To: list-managers@greatcircle.com Subject: Re: Charge for Spamming and it will go away In-reply-to: moose's message of Tue, 13 Dec 1994 17:33:34 -0500. <9412132234.AA08578@svcdudes.com> Date: Tue, 13 Dec 1994 18:21:31 -0500 From: Chris Siebenmann Message-Id: <94Dec13.182133est.24145@hawkwind.utcs.utoronto.ca> Sender: list-managers-owner@GreatCircle.COM Precedence: bulk There is a simple non-technical solution to this problem; it is successfully dealing with the same problem with fax machines and automated telephone calls. And that's to have laws passed making it illegal to do. I'm not in favor of trying to charge people money to do it; all that's likely to happen is that they won't pay you. Then you get to chase them through the court system, a considerable amount of work for non-local people. - cks From list-managers-owner Tue Dec 13 15:42:09 1994 Received: (daemon@localhost) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) id PAA29998 for list-managers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 15:26:55 -0800 Received: from sunshine.eushc.org (sunshine.eushc.org [163.246.32.110]) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) with ESMTP id PAA29993 for ; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 15:26:51 -0800 Received: from knex.UUCP (uucp@localhost) by sunshine.eushc.org (8.6.8.1/EUSHC) with UUCP id SAA08347; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 18:25:35 -0500 Received: by mind.org (8.6.9/mind.org) with UUCP id RAA07840; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 17:03:57 -0500 Received: by knex.mind.org (1.65/waf) via UUCP; Tue, 13 Dec 94 14:01:34 EST for list-managers@GreatCircle.COM To: list-managers@GreatCircle.COM Subject: Re: Fwd: Your ad posting to our mailing list From: Gess Shankar Reply-To: gess@knex.mind.org (Gess Shankar) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 13 Dec 94 13:58:33 EST In-Reply-To: <49857.fholson@maroon.tc.umn.edu> Organization: |<><>| Knowledge Exchange, GA, USA |<><>| Sender: list-managers-owner@GreatCircle.COM Precedence: bulk "Fred H Olson WB0YQM" writes: > I am writing to protest your recent inappropriate, > unwelcome and unauthorized attempt to > post your long advertisement to our mailing list. I request that you > refrain from doing this and post an > apology to List-Managers@GreatCircle.COM > > If you do not do so your reputation on the net will be tarnished > worse than it already has been. It appears that this Choice file sale message is so important that every single mailing list has been the target of this posting. Every single mailing list I run received one of these.... Grrrrr. GeSS -- Gess Shankar |<><>|Internet: gess@knex.mind.ORG |<><>| Knowledge Exchange|<><>|:::::::::::::::::::::::::|<><>| From list-managers-owner Tue Dec 13 16:09:54 1994 Received: (daemon@localhost) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) id QAA00714 for list-managers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 16:08:29 -0800 Received: (mcb@localhost) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) id QAA00706; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 16:08:27 -0800 Message-Id: <199412140008.QAA00706@miles.greatcircle.com> From: mcb@greatcircle.com (Michael C. Berch) Date: Tue, 13 Dec 1994 16:08:27 +0000 In-Reply-To: <49857.fholson@maroon.tc.umn.edu> X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92) To: list-managers@greatcircle.com Subject: Please DO NOT respond to spam on the list-managers list Cc: fholson@maroon.tc.umn.edu Sender: list-managers-owner@GreatCircle.COM Precedence: bulk If you feel you must respond to the spam posted by "actuary@ix.netcom.com" to this and many other mailing lists, please do so by mail directly to that account and/or its service provider, or in an appropriate newsgroup like alt.current-events.net-abuse. Please do not respond via the list-managers mailing list, regardless of content, or solicit an apology here, or whatever. As usual, the worst part of spam are the endless rounds of followups, which dwarf the original message's obnoxiousness quotient by sheer volume. Discussion of list management policy and technical issues related to the spamming of mailing lists, is, of course, welcome. -- Michael C. Berch List-Managers list manager List stuff: list-managers-owner@greatcircle.com In real life: mcb@postmodern.com / mcb@netcom.com / mcb@greatcircle.com From list-managers-owner Tue Dec 13 16:39:44 1994 Received: (daemon@localhost) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) id QAA01027 for list-managers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 16:34:28 -0800 Received: from svcdudes.com (bastion.svcdudes.com [198.6.226.3]) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) with SMTP id QAA01022 for ; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 16:34:25 -0800 Message-Id: <9412140037.AA09011@svcdudes.com> Received: by moose.svcdudes.com (NX5.67d/NX3.0X) id AA02486; Tue, 13 Dec 94 16:36:46 -0800 Received: by NeXT.Mailer (1.112.1) Content-Type: text/plain Mime-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3 v112.1) From: Michael Rutman Date: Tue, 13 Dec 94 16:36:44 -0800 To: Chris Siebenmann Subject: Re: Charge for Spamming and it will go away Cc: list-managers@greatcircle.com Sender: list-managers-owner@GreatCircle.COM Precedence: bulk > > There is a simple non-technical solution to this problem; it is > successfully dealing with the same problem with fax machines and > automated telephone calls. And that's to have laws passed making > it illegal to do. If there is a law, then you lose flexibility. Right now, there is no control. By forcing people to read acceptable use and charging them for what you don't want, you use existing laws to enforce your flexibility. > > I'm not in favor of trying to charge people money to do it; all > that's likely to happen is that they won't pay you. Then you get > to chase them through the court system, a considerable amount of > work for non-local people. > Then charge them large amounts and turn people who violate it over the the D.A. or F.B.I. depending upon whether it's interstate or not. Make it $25,000 and call it Grand Theft. Lot's of ways to stop spamming there. --- Michael Rutman | moose@svcdudes.com Programmer | Macintosh and NeXT programmer Software Ventures | maker of MicroPhone Pro #include | really offensive political statement From list-managers-owner Tue Dec 13 17:10:09 1994 Received: (daemon@localhost) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) id RAA01325 for list-managers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 17:01:47 -0800 Received: from rabbit.wmin.ac.uk (pp@rabbit.wmin.ac.uk [161.74.160.10]) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) with ESMTP id RAA01319 for ; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 17:01:42 -0800 Received: from newbadger.wmin.ac.uk by rabbit.wmin.ac.uk with Internet SMTP (PP); Wed, 14 Dec 1994 00:56:45 +0000 Received: by newbadger.wmin.ac.uk id AA13588 (5.67b/WMIN-CLIENT-1.1); Wed, 14 Dec 1994 01:00:09 GMT From: Malcolm Ray Message-Id: <199412140100.AA13588@newbadger.wmin.ac.uk> Subject: Re: Charge for Spamming and it will go away To: moose@svcdudes.com (Michael Rutman) Date: Wed, 14 Dec 1994 01:00:09 +0000 (GMT) Cc: list-managers@greatcircle.com, malcolmr@westminster.ac.uk (Malcolm Ray) In-Reply-To: <9412140037.AA09011@svcdudes.com> from "Michael Rutman" at Dec 13, 94 04:36:44 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 961 Sender: list-managers-owner@GreatCircle.COM Precedence: bulk > > I'm not in favor of trying to charge people money to do it; all > > that's likely to happen is that they won't pay you. Then you get > > to chase them through the court system, a considerable amount of > > work for non-local people. > > > > Then charge them large amounts and turn people who violate it over the the > D.A. or F.B.I. depending upon whether it's interstate or not. Make it > $25,000 and call it Grand Theft. Lot's of ways to stop spamming there. > > --- > Michael Rutman | moose@svcdudes.com > Programmer | Macintosh and NeXT programmer > Software Ventures | maker of MicroPhone Pro > #include | really offensive political statement > If the spamming were performed by a company based in, say, Singapore, would you regard this as interstate? Would the FBI have jurisdiction? -- -- University of Westminster Information Resource Services M.G.Ray@westminster.ac.uk +44 171 911 5000 From list-managers-owner Tue Dec 13 17:39:41 1994 Received: (daemon@localhost) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) id RAA01492 for list-managers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 17:17:10 -0800 Received: from svcdudes.com (bastion.svcdudes.com [198.6.226.3]) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) with SMTP id RAA01467 for ; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 17:15:16 -0800 Message-Id: <9412140112.AA09108@svcdudes.com> Received: by moose.svcdudes.com (NX5.67d/NX3.0X) id AA02498; Tue, 13 Dec 94 17:11:21 -0800 Received: by NeXT.Mailer (1.112.1) Content-Type: text/plain Mime-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3 v112.1) From: Michael Rutman Date: Tue, 13 Dec 94 17:11:20 -0800 To: Malcolm Ray Subject: Re: Charge for Spamming and it will go away Cc: list-managers@greatcircle.com Sender: list-managers-owner@GreatCircle.COM Precedence: bulk > > > > Then charge them large amounts and turn people who violate it over the the > > D.A. or F.B.I. depending upon whether it's interstate or not. Make it > > $25,000 and call it Grand Theft. Lot's of ways to stop spamming there. > > > > If the spamming were performed by a company based in, say, Singapore, would > you regard this as interstate? Would the FBI have jurisdiction? > Since I haven't seen any spamming from Singapore, I'm going to assume that this is a hypothetical question. Usually, I believe it's best to leave the hypothetical in the hypothetical if it isn't relative to the problem. In addition, I doubt there would be much spamming from Singapore since international trade is difficult enough for there to be barriers to prevent a profit at spamming. Remember, spamming only works when it's easy to receive the money from the people you spam. Out of country people don't get this benefit. --- Michael Rutman | moose@svcdudes.com Programmer | Macintosh and NeXT programmer Software Ventures | maker of MicroPhone Pro #include | really offensive political statement From list-managers-owner Tue Dec 13 20:39:47 1994 Received: (daemon@localhost) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) id UAA02859 for list-managers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 20:10:10 -0800 Received: from intercon.com (root@intercon.com [149.52.1.88]) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) with ESMTP id UAA02854 for ; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 20:10:07 -0800 Received: from localhost by intercon.com (Sendmail 8.6.5/940209.RS/940908.JB) id XAA08546; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 23:08:52 -0500 Date: Tue, 13 Dec 1994 23:08:52 -0500 From: jailbait@intercon.com (Jailbait) Message-Id: <199412140408.XAA08546@intercon.com> To: list-managers@GreatCircle.COM Subject: Re: Please DO NOT respond to spam on the list-managers list Sender: list-managers-owner@GreatCircle.COM Precedence: bulk Don't bother responding to the liquidation spam... Netcom's already killed the account... JB From list-managers-owner Wed Dec 14 10:40:09 1994 Received: (daemon@localhost) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) id KAA00891 for list-managers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Dec 1994 10:22:54 -0800 Received: from mycroft.GreatCircle.COM (mycroft.greatcircle.com [143.191.19.67]) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) with ESMTP id KAA00790 for ; Wed, 14 Dec 1994 10:22:31 -0800 Received: from d.ecc.engr.uky.edu by mycroft.GreatCircle.COM (8.6.5/SMI-4.1/Brent-941015) id EAA10286; Wed, 14 Dec 1994 04:37:15 -0800 Received: from s.ecc.engr.uky.edu by d.ecc.engr.uky.edu (5.59/25-eef) id AA03659; Wed, 14 Dec 94 07:30:44 EST Received: by s.ecc.engr.uky.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA15368; Wed, 14 Dec 94 07:33:18 EST Date: Wed, 14 Dec 94 07:33:18 EST From: morgan@engr.uky.edu (Wes Morgan) Message-Id: <9412141233.AA15368@s.ecc.engr.uky.edu> To: list-managers@greatcircle.com Subject: Re: 'Court Ordered Liquidation' mailing Sender: list-managers-owner@GreatCircle.COM Precedence: bulk According to support@netcom.com, that user has been "permanently removed from the system for abuse of Usenet and mailing lists." From list-managers-owner Thu Dec 15 15:10:21 1994 Received: (daemon@localhost) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) id PAA23329 for list-managers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Dec 1994 15:06:06 -0800 Received: from vmd.cso.uiuc.edu (vmd.cso.uiuc.edu [128.174.5.98]) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) with SMTP id PAA23324 for ; Thu, 15 Dec 1994 15:05:53 -0800 Received: from VMD.CSO.UIUC.EDU by vmd.cso.uiuc.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 9030; Thu, 15 Dec 94 17:04:58 CST Received: from ILSTU (NJE origin SYSMWTR@ILSTU) by VMD.CSO.UIUC.EDU (LMail V1.2a/1.8a) with BSMTP id 9273; Thu, 15 Dec 1994 17:04:58 -0600 FROM: "MIKE TOMLIANOVICH" SUBJECT: Fwd: Your ad posting to our m DATE: 15 DEC 1994 17:06 -00 MESSAGE-ID: TO: Sender: list-managers-owner@GreatCircle.COM Precedence: bulk Just thought I would mention that I feel that this thing called spamming is not bad. I welcome these kinds of messages. *** Original Author: FHOLSON @ UMN - ** Remote User **; 12/13/94 10:44am >Return-Path: >Received: from UIUCVM42 (NJE origin SMTP@UIUCVM42) by VM42.CSO.UIUC.EDU (LMail > V1.2a/1.8a) with BSMTP id 6132; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 16:40:21 +0000 >Received: from relay1.UU.NET by vm42.cso.uiuc.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with TCP; > Tue, 13 Dec 94 16:40:16 UTC >Received: from miles.greatcircle.com by relay1.UU.NET with ESMTP > id QQxucw08093; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 11:39:44 -0500 >Received: (daemon@localhost) by miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) id > IAA25512 for list-managers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 08:13:53 -0800 >Received: from maroon.tc.umn.edu (maroon.tc.umn.edu 128.101.118.21 ) by > miles.greatcircle.com (8.6.9/Miles-941015-1) with SMTP id IAA25507 for > ; Tue, 13 Dec 1994 08:13:48 -0800 >Received: from dialup-1-53.gw.umn.edu by maroon.tc.umn.edu; Tue, > 13 Dec 94 10:08:01 -0500 >Date: Tue, 13 Dec 94 10:07:39 CST >From: "Fred H Olson WB0YQM" >Message-Id: <49857.fholson@maroon.tc.umn.edu> >X-Minuet-Version: Minuet1.0_Beta_17A >Reply-To: >X-POPMail-Charset: English >To: List-Managers@GreatCircle.COM >Subject: Fwd: Your ad posting to our mailing list >Sender: list-managers-owner@GreatCircle.COM >Precedence: bulk > ----- Forwarded message begins here ----- From: Fred H Olson WB0YQM To: ACTUARY@IX.NETCOM.COM Date: Tue, 13 Dec 94 10:06:59 CST Subject: Your ad posting to our mailing list TO: Choice Trading Company Lot #1776 202 So. Broadway Los Angeles, Ca. 90012 (213) 856 6172 Lionel M. Goldberg Actuary >Reason for rejection: sender not subscribed. >------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >Choice Trading Company, Court Appointed Liquidators, have >been assigned to liquidate the following Multi-Million Dollar >inventory of computer Memory Chips, CPU's and Hard Disk Drives. >All items are new and come with applicable manufactures warranty. >Prices quoted include all state and local taxes plus shipping and >handling. I am writing to protest your recent inappropriate, unwelcome and unauthorized attempt to post your long advertisement to our mailing list. I request that you refrain from doing this and post an apology to List-Managers@GreatCircle.COM If you do not do so your reputation on the net will be tarnished worse than it already has been. Sincerely, Fred ------ Forwarded message ends here ------ -- Fred H. Olson fholson@uci.com (612)588-9532 Amateur radio: WB0YQM 1221 Russell Av N, Minneapolis, MN 55411 Sysop of COHOUSING-L listserv & gopherspace: gopher.uci.com or via EDIN gopher in Calif. Now avail. Cohousing-WWW (see gopher for URL) || TC Freenet goes public 1/95 |4AI *** Comments from MJTOMLIA - TOMLIANOVICH, MIKE; 12/15/94 05:04pm: