Great Circle Associates Majordomo-Users
(July 1995)

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Subject: Re: Bounced messages to all subscribers
From: Harlan Harris <harris @ aix . wingra . com>
Date: Wed, 19 Jul 1995 12:53:12 -0500
To: kc7iay @ ibm . net (Bruce Miller)
Cc: majordomo-users @ greatcircle . com
In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 19 Jul 1995 09:15:58 EDT." <>

Bruce Miller writes:
>I've a curious and aggravating situation.  Messages sent to bad addresses are 
>getting bounced back and in turn sent out to everyone on the list, rather than
> just ot the list owner.  

Blech, the message you quote has gone through WAY too many machines, but I'll 
take a guess.

Starting at the bottom, with the original message:
>           Original text follows 
>Received: by ccmail

This is the problem. Cc:Mail only has a To: line, a From: line, and a Subject: 
line. There is NO support for any sort of Return-path or Sender line. 
Therefore, if the cc:Mail system can't deliver a mail message, it will go to 
the From: address. If the SMTP->cc:Mail gateway maps the wrong thing to the 
>From line, then you get the behaviour you specify, and there's nothing you can 
do about it with Majordomo. Except drop the culprit from your list, with a 
complaint to the postmaster, but that might be overkill...

>Received:  from cdp by (UUPC/extended 1.11) with UUCP;
>           Thu, 13 Jul 1995 12:55:23 PDT
>Received: from ( []) by
> (8.6.12/Revision: 1.203 ) with SMTP id MAA08997 for
><>; Thu, 13 Jul 1995 12:10:36 -0700
>Received: (from majordom@localhost) by (8.6.12/8.6.12) id
>LAA09589 for asjacw-l-outgoing; Thu, 13 Jul 1995 11:11:06 -0700
>Date: Thu, 13 Jul 1995 11:11:06 -0700

Well, it's not mapping From: -> From...

>X-ccAdmin: scpostmaster@cdp
>Message-Id: <>
>Subject: ASJACW: ASJA Contracts Watch

Not Sender: either...

>Precedence: bulk

Not Reply-To:, that's good.


It must either be this line (!), or the envelope sender, which is lost. If you 
had a copy of the message that has not gone around the world in back, we'd be 
able to see the Reply-Path...

OK, moving on to the bounce message...

>From Thu Jul 13 16:31:13 1995
>Received: from by with ESMTP
>	( id AA132037473; Thu, 13 Jul 1995 16:31:13 -0400
>Return-Path: <>
>Received: from ( []) by
> (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id NAA05501 for
><>; Thu, 13 Jul 1995 13:30:25 -0700
>Received: (from uucp) by (8.6.12/Revision: 1.203 ) id
>NAA24218; Thu, 13 Jul 1995 13:28:55 -0700
>Received: from cc:Mail UUCPLINK 2.0 by
>	id 9506138056.AA805665341 Thu, 13 Jul 95 12:55:41 
>Date: Thu, 13 Jul 95 12:55:41 
>Message-Id: <>
>Subject: cc:Mail UUCPLINK 2.0 Undeliverable Message
>Subj:	cc:Mail UUCPLINK 2.0 Undeliverable Message
>Date:	95-07-13 16:32:18 EDT
>Resource error - try resending
>           Original text follows 

I don't understand this at all. How did the Sierra Club and Compuserve get in 
here? And why is the top Received line at AOL? I'm lost.

Anyway, there's my guess at the problem. Assuming you've got your list set up 
with the Return-Path set to, that's the best you can do.

The other alternative is to buy Listproc 7.1, which does detection of bounce 
messages sent to lists. It's pretty cool, but it's not cheap.

 -Harlan Harris

Harlan Harris                 Wingra Technologies, Inc.             (608) 238-4454
snail://USA/53711/WI/Madison/450 Science Dr/One West/Harlan Harris

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